Dominique Ansel, James Beard Award-winning Pastry Chef and Owner of Dominique Ansel Bakery

Dominique Ansel is the Chef and Owner of eponymous bakeries in New York, London, Hong Kong, and Los Angeles. From humble beginnings in France, Ansel found his culinary passion through military service in South America as part of a community program teaching locals how to cook. Upon returning to France, his career took off when he landed a position at the legendary pastry shop Fauchon. Ansel later moved to New York City to become the Executive Pastry Chef at Daniel and eventually opened his own bakery in 2011, which gained worldwide recognition two years later with the creation of the Cronut®, named by TIME Magazine as one of the “25 Best Inventions of 2013”. Ansel has since won numerous accolades for his innovation and craftsmanship, including the Ordre du Mérite Agricole award, the second highest honor in France, and Outstanding Pastry Chef in U.S. at the inaugural Taste Talk Awards. Outside of the kitchen, Dominique is a dedicated supporter of various charitable organizations, including the fight to end hunger with Food Bank for New York City, City Harvest, and God’s Love We Deliver.

Business Today (Grace Hong): You’ve had a diverse set of experiences prior to creating Dominique Ansel, spanning from serving in the military to working at world-class pastry shop Fauchon. Can you tell us a little about what drove you to create your own pastry shop, and how you’ve integrated the lessons you’ve learned from the variety of other places you’ve worked?

Dominique Ansel: I grew up in a small town in France, not being fancy at all, and my dad used to work in the factory. When I grew up, we didn’t have much as I was in a family of four kids. I stumbled upon the industry and started working in the kitchen by providence. I didn’t know what to do or where to go. Eventually I found my way there. I worked at Fauchon, a bakery in Paris, for eight years, traveled the world, and opened up shops with them in nine different countries. It was very eye-opening, and it was a really unique experience to be so young and have the chance to travel. I learned a lot about different cultures, different people, and different ways of living; I’ve learned a great deal. When I came back to France, I used some of this spirit to collect my thoughts. I always wanted to open my own shop; when I was a kid, I always wanted something of my own. I didn’t know what it was going to be, or where it was going to be. Eventually, I came to New York, and I worked for Chef Daniel Boulud. And about eight years ago, I opened up my own shop focused on pastry.

BT: What is your philosophy at Dominique Ansel, and how do you incorporate it into your team and leadership?

The DKA, or “Dominique’s Kouign Amann” (image credits to Thomas Schauer)

DA: Through all the things I’ve learned in my life so far and all the people I’ve met, they have made me really humble. There’s so much to learn and see from this world, and I’m excited to be able to be creative and express myself through the art of pastry. I think it’s unbelievable⁠—it’s just amazing—to be able to do that. There’s so much emotional connection that I get from creating a story through a pastry, and making sure [customers] remember what they eat is very important to me. For the values behind our leadership, it has to be honest, simple, and genuine, and if you do that, it means a lot.

BT: Let’s talk more about the values maintained at your different bakeries and restaurants. The SoHo bakery maintains a core value of “creativity” while the Dominique Ansel Kitchen values “time.” How did you come up with these values, and how do the restaurants stick to both of those values?

DA: It’s hard to be creative; it’s not easy. You’re not born creative. You have to work for it, you have to bake, you have to research, you have to test, you have to practice, you have to fail, and you have to quickly learn all these skills. Having a chance [to be creative], especially myself, was just amazing, and I didn’t want to bake things as they were. The Cronut® is a perfect example. When it went viral, everyone wanted to create Cronut® shops and open factories across the country and around the world. That is exactly what I did not want to do. I wanted to move on creatively and have a chance to keep on expressing myself for the future and in the momentum of time. Every time we do a new concept, a new shop, a new menu—every time, it’s something new. I don’t recycle ideas, but I challenge myself and my team to think harder and come up with more ideas.

“Every time we do a new concept, a new shop, a new menu—every time, it’s something new. I don’t recycle ideas, but I challenge myself and my team to think harder and come up with more ideas.”

BT: Given Dominique Ansel Bakery’s locations around the world, how do you adapt to different cultures while maintaining a uniform global brand?

DA: We work very much with each local team on their creations. Of course, I work with them to develop the food and its quality. We use a lot of different apps to share photos, share videos, and share ideas. There’s no idea that comes without hard work. It’s very hard to be connected with different time zones, different countries, and different concepts, so you really have to dive into it and give it a lot of thought and work. Especially for new ideas, you need to consider what is tradition and what makes it successful. Every place is different, so we try to adapt our pastries to where we are.

BT: You mentioned launching many new concepts, and along that line of thought, how do you market your products? Is it often driven by virality?

DA: I never think too much about how to market a product. I never have to because of the work we do ahead of time—thinking of the idea, the concept, the product, how our guests will react to it, why they like it as well. These connections with the guests makes everything pretty organic. It’s never like we are thinking of how to commercialize the idea. For me, it’s about sharing with our followers, sharing what we do, what we like, what we love. When they like it—most of them like it, I would say—it’s pretty organic. It’s pretty simple: we show what we love and people show their love for it.

The Cronut®, an inventive combination of the croissant and donut, was an instant success and became the world’s first-ever viral pastry in 2013. (image credits to BT Design Team)

BT: Talking more about social media and virality, the Cronut® was the first world-viral pastry. What is your opinion on the growing emphasis towards trendy, Instagrammable food, especially in places like New York, where there’s a lot of competition between restaurants? Will this hurt more hole-in-the-wall places that don’t have a social media presence or restaurants where the food may not be as aesthetic?

DA: I think social media is very important. It’s a platform to express yourself and show who you are. It’s not everything though, and people shouldn’t give themselves a headache to use it. A lot of people use it to promote stuff or to keep track of everything they like. It’s a place to share, and it has to be done successfully. It’s a great tool for business, and it’s great for individuals and New York too. I think it changes, like everything else in life, and nowadays, there are a lot of companies wondering what they should do [with social media]. For me, it’s very important to show who people are in real life. People now hide behind social media; a lot of people look like they have fabulous lives, but it’s just nice photos, you know? Social media is a great tool, and as it changes, we have to change too. We are inspired by and guided by what the future will be. We must be open-minded on how to utilize media, and staying true and real is important.

BT: Your Instagram mixes photos from your own creations to culinary experiences beyond your bakery. What is the importance of showcasing not only your work but those of other restaurants around the world on your own Instagram?

“It may be a simple craft or a different industry, but I like to show my followers all the people who work as hard as they do every day.”

DA: I want to showcase authenticity: real people that create real food. It’s honestly kind of like what my career has been like: humble and casual and good food. There’s no thought of promoting something or promoting someone. It’s people who make good things, and I give them credit because I know how hard they worked to do what they do. It may be a simple craft or a different industry, but I like to show my followers all the people who work as hard as they do every day.

BT: When the Cronut® did become viral, what was your reaction? Are there any frustrations you’ve experienced over the years with your pastries becoming viral?

DA: When it happened, it happened very fast. In the first few years, apps like Instagram and social media were just coming up. It happened so fast that I honestly don’t remember much—it felt like it happened in my mind. It was honestly so big, and we had lines of over seven hundred people after day two outside of the bakery before the doors opened. It was just insane, and it was really hard to manage and hard for the employees at the time. But you know, it’s great that it happened. It’s amazing that the Cronut® is a living creation. It’s beautiful to see that pastry can bring people together, and I’m very fortunate to be the one who brought this together. It’s actually a great thing. I don’t think I have any frustrations. Yes, you have a lot of people and you have to worry about making enough. Also, we only had four people on the team at the time, and we had a tiny, tiny kitchen, probably a similar size to what you have at home. We did everything we could. The frustration is more like not being able to satisfy everyone in the beginning; now we can better afford to do that. We worked really, really hard, and we keep on working really hard to preserve the quality and authenticity of our product. 

“The most important thing is to create food to share. You don’t create pastries to go viral, you should create food for people. If you have the right intention at the beginning, then the rest will follow.”

BT: Alongside all these viral creations, there are many other pastries that are just as delicious. Do you ever consider how to balance both of these pastries?

DA: If I create food to go viral, that’s the wrong way of thinking. You create food because you love eating. I like creating food because I like connecting with people and telling a story through our pastries because it is an emotional connection with childhood memories. That’s it. The rest will do it on its own. If people like it, then I’m happy, and if people like it less, I’m still happy with my creation. The most important thing is to create food to share. You don’t create pastries to go viral, you should create food for people. If you have the right intention at the beginning, then the rest will follow.

BT: One of my favorite aspects of DAB is that during long waits for the Cronut®, the Dominique Ansel team will hand out some sample pastries for customers in line to snack on. Can you talk about how small details like these factor into the overall customer experience you’re trying to curate?

DA: I’m a chef; I work with people everyday. It’s important for me to be welcoming and treat people the best way possible. If you have a line outside, you cannot just ignore the customers out there. They’re outside the shop, and they’re waiting for you. Of course, we have Cronut pastries that are coming out soon, but I want to focus on hospitality. That’s why we bake fresh madeleines for those in line that morning and hot chocolate in the winter. I want to show people that we care that they line up for us because they are giving away some of their time. We have to be respectful and understanding, and we should be thankful for them coming in and waiting for us. It doesn’t matter if you’re inside or outside, or if the line is short or long. 

BT: What has been the most challenging aspect of being a business owner?

The Cookie Shot (image credits to Evan Sung)

DA: Upon becoming a business owner, I had to become a completely different person. As a chef, you’re constantly in the kitchen and your own department—it’s all about cooking. When you have a business and manage a team, you have to think about many perspectives that you didn’t think about before. You work with employees, you talk about issues with customers, you think about menu creation—there are just so many aspects and decisions that come to you when you lead a company. I think the most challenging is to be there for everybody. I make myself very much available throughout the day. I wake up at five in the morning; I go to bed at midnight every day. I speak with my team every day, almost all of the managers from different places around the world, and it’s hard to make time for everybody. It’s hard to be there with them always, but I try to guide them, follow up, and build a great support system. I always wish I were doing it even more. Time is definitely the biggest constraint. If I had more time, I would give it to all the chefs. It’s okay though because it’s also a time for one to grow and learn. It gives you guidance and support as much as it is a challenge, and you see people growing and learning as well.

BT: You’ve had an incredible journey. What is a lesson you’ve learned that you’d like to share with the undergraduates who read this publication?

DA: One of the most important things I’ve learned in life is don’t be afraid. People throughout my entire life told me no or it’d be too hard. When I was sixteen, they said don’t go to Paris, it’s too hard, and then don’t go to New York, it’s going to be too hard. People told me not to spend my life opening a bakery in New York because a lot of people don’t make it. People gave me a lot of advice that I didn’t ask for and think they know better when they don’t. Those people will give you bad advice at times, and they make you worried. They make you fear, doubt, and question yourself. Don’t be afraid of pursuing your own vision when you’re confident in yourself. To make things work, you have to try. If you fail, that’s okay; it’s a part of life for everyone and we all learn from our mistakes and do better work. Don’t ever be afraid of always trying, always doing your best. Not being afraid will give you a chance to really be successful in your life.

Blossoming Hot Chocolate (image credits to Dominique Ansel Bakery)

Short Questions

Three qualities of your perfect pastry: memory (something that you will remember), emotion (something that will make you feel something), taste (something that will make you want to salivate and eat more)

What has been your most terrible culinary creation?

I don’t think I’ve had a terrible creation—I’ve worked in a kitchen for 15 - 20 years of making observations. By the time you’ve spent that much time in the kitchen, you know what works and what doesn’t. You know the flavors and textures, and by the time you start creating, you should have enough experience. Of course, I’ve had pastries that I’m not happy with, where I’ve worked on it for two months and then don’t put it on the menu, but I’ve never had a disastrous creation.

What is the best combination of foods you’ve ever tried, in terms of flavor?

My favorite would be coconut, raspberry, and balsamic vinegar. If you think about it on the flavor profile, it is the best of the best. You have the coconut which is rich, warm, a little bit like Paris, and then you have the raspberry which is acidic, and you have the balsamic which is very nutty and dark. When you put the flavors together, it’s a burst of flavor in your mouth.

What is your favorite savory food?

I love food so much, it’s hard to choose. I love Taiwanese food. My fiancée is Taiwanese, so we make a lot of Taiwanese food at home and I cook a lot myself. I also love eggs.

If you weren’t a chef, what would you have chosen instead as your profession?

I think it would be something creative. I love design, architecture, modern art, literature. I love creating and designing, so it would be something creative for sure.